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MILIS MURTADIN_KAFIRUN
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Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
+7
mistik6666
hamba tuhan1
bayo_lubis
syurga bidadari
sabda alam
jelasnggak
cooler
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Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
pengakuan jujur dari Kardinal Wina :
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
cooler- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
cooler wrote:pengakuan jujur dari Kardinal Wina :
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
MEMANG BETUL TOH APA YG DIKATAKAN KARDINAL TSB.
DI KRISTEN TIDAK BOLEH KAWIN CERAI SEENAKNYA....
BERBEDA DENGAN DI ISLAM,..
KALAU DI ISLAM,.. KAU BOLEH KAWIN SAMPAI 4 KALI, ASAL MAMPU ADIL.
KALAU ISTRI TUA SUDAH MEMBOSANKAN, MAKA BOLEH DI CERAI.
KALAU DICERAI, ISTRI SEKARANG TINGGAL 3 DOONGGG...
KALAU SUDAH 3 TENTU BOLEH TAMBAH LAGI SATU.. (MASIH ADA SATU SPOT YG KOSONG)
...
NAH...
DI KRISTEN NGGA ADA YG KAYAK GINI....
KALAU SUDAH KAWIN-KAWIN-AN SEPERTI BEGITU,.... NANTI AKAN MASUK SURGA, KARENA PADA DASARNYA MEREKA CUMAN MELAKSANAKAN SUNAH NABINYA (KAWINILAH DUA, TIGA, EMPAT)....
NAH DI SURGA LEBIH ENAK LAGI NANTI....
MEREKA BISA ESEK-ESEK DARI PAGI SAMPAI MALAM TRUUUUSSSSSSSS GOYANG....
KARENA DISURGA MEREKA ADA 72 BIDADARI YANG MENANTI GILIRAN UNTUK DI ESEK.
NAH INI YG GAK ADA DI KRISTEN.
GILA BENER,.. KAYAK ROKOK JI SAM SUE SAJA (DUA TIGA EMPAT)
HA HA HA
Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
orang-orang barat yang memang bisa berpikir secara lebih kritis dan cerdas, sudah banyak yang sadar, gak mau nyembah tuhan yang punya alat kelamin..
lagipula kalau kristen, gay boleh, lesbi boleh, kawin ama anjing boleh, kawin ama pohon natal, boleh....
yaaa...habis lah lama-lama..
lagipula kalau kristen, gay boleh, lesbi boleh, kawin ama anjing boleh, kawin ama pohon natal, boleh....
yaaa...habis lah lama-lama..
cooler- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
ya gitulah bro...jelas nggak ini mengira nabi2nya bermonogami semua...dan melarang poligami soalnya tuhan yang dipercaya khan masih single bro...hehehehecooler wrote:orang-orang barat yang memang bisa berpikir secara lebih kritis dan cerdas, sudah banyak yang sadar, gak mau nyembah tuhan yang punya alat kelamin..
lagipula kalau kristen, gay boleh, lesbi boleh, kawin ama anjing boleh, kawin ama pohon natal, boleh....
yaaa...habis lah lama-lama..
sabda alam- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
Hahahaha...
APA GAK TERBALIK TUH !!!
Islam lah yg akan mendekati kehancuran
Kita bisa liat Revolusi di Timur Tengah, mulai dari Tunisia, Mesir, Libya, sebentar lagi menyusul Maroko, Yaman hingga semua negara Timur Tengah yg kesemua negara itu adalah negara2 diktator yg mayoritas muslim.
Skarang udh jaman globalisasi, keterbukaan, internet hampir menjangkau keseluruh dunia, Orang2 udh berani mengkritik termasuk agamanya sendiri. Hal ini skrang yg terjadi dalam dunia islam, dimana umat muslim sdh dapat berpikir scr logis, jernih & sesuai akal sehat. Mereka sangat meragukan ajaran2 nabi muhamad, termasuk kelakuan nabinya yg trdapat dalam alquran & hadist.
Kebanyakan para intelektual muslim sangat prihatin atas perbuatan nabi muhamad yg membunuh, memenggal & menjadikan budak bagi orang2 yg melawan ajarannya, walaupun ditulis sesuai dgn perintah auloh, tetapi mereka berpikir, bgmn auloh memberikan perintah sekejam itu ?.
Para intelektual muslim jg sangat prihatin atas kelakuan nabi muhamad yg mempunyai sekurang-kurangnya 12 istri, apalagi muhamad sangat berhasrat untuk menikahi Aisyah yg berumur 7 thn & menungganginya umur 9 thn, apalagi muhamad seorang kanibal yg mengawini menantunya sendiri, kaya gak ada wanita lain aja. Ini benar2 kelakuan seorang Phedophil, sex maniac yg memalukan.
Skrg banyak wanita muslim yg protes dg ajaran nabinya ttg poligami, ini terjadi dg walikota bogor yg kawin sm cewek lulusan SMU, AA gym yg langsung dihujat ibu2 stelah kawin lagi.
Dan yg paling parah adalah kehidupan di akhirat. Para intelektual muslim yg berpikit jernih, logis, terbuka & menggunakan akal sehat, sangat-sangat-sangat meragukan kehidupan syurga islam spt yg tercantum dlm kitab suci .Mereka tidak dapat membayangkan bila syurganya nanti seperti Pasar Sex, ada 72 bidadari yg siap melayani nafsu birahi setiap saat, bisa makan minum semaunya, termasuk daging babi, anjing & minuman keras.
Para intelektual itu pasti berpikir jika surga itu tempat berkumpul orang2 yg beriman, taqwa kpd Tuhan & berbuat baik selama hidupnya. Jadi mana mungkin di syurga ada kegiatan yg memalukan seperti itu ?
Dulu para muslim sangat takut bila bertanya ttg hal2 yg ditulis diatas, mereka hanya menerima saja dgn pasrah ajaran nabinya.
Sekarang sdh mulai tumbuh benih2 demokrasi di negara Timur-Tengah, mereka sudah mengenal internet & menggunakan Facebook, Twitter, Google dll. Kesadaran mereka sudah tinggi & meragukan ajaran2 nabinya yg sungguh2 melanggar HAM. Mereka juga sangat membenci para teroris yg membunuh, ngebom orang2 tidak berdosa atas ajaran Islam.
Sekarang adalah era keterbukaan, demokrasi & menjunjung tinggi HAM. Ajaran & kelakukan nabi muhamad benar2 memalukan & tidak dapat dipertanggung jawabkan. Cepat atau lambat mereka akan sadar & Murtad dgn sendirinya.
APA GAK TERBALIK TUH !!!
Islam lah yg akan mendekati kehancuran
Kita bisa liat Revolusi di Timur Tengah, mulai dari Tunisia, Mesir, Libya, sebentar lagi menyusul Maroko, Yaman hingga semua negara Timur Tengah yg kesemua negara itu adalah negara2 diktator yg mayoritas muslim.
Skarang udh jaman globalisasi, keterbukaan, internet hampir menjangkau keseluruh dunia, Orang2 udh berani mengkritik termasuk agamanya sendiri. Hal ini skrang yg terjadi dalam dunia islam, dimana umat muslim sdh dapat berpikir scr logis, jernih & sesuai akal sehat. Mereka sangat meragukan ajaran2 nabi muhamad, termasuk kelakuan nabinya yg trdapat dalam alquran & hadist.
Kebanyakan para intelektual muslim sangat prihatin atas perbuatan nabi muhamad yg membunuh, memenggal & menjadikan budak bagi orang2 yg melawan ajarannya, walaupun ditulis sesuai dgn perintah auloh, tetapi mereka berpikir, bgmn auloh memberikan perintah sekejam itu ?.
Para intelektual muslim jg sangat prihatin atas kelakuan nabi muhamad yg mempunyai sekurang-kurangnya 12 istri, apalagi muhamad sangat berhasrat untuk menikahi Aisyah yg berumur 7 thn & menungganginya umur 9 thn, apalagi muhamad seorang kanibal yg mengawini menantunya sendiri, kaya gak ada wanita lain aja. Ini benar2 kelakuan seorang Phedophil, sex maniac yg memalukan.
Skrg banyak wanita muslim yg protes dg ajaran nabinya ttg poligami, ini terjadi dg walikota bogor yg kawin sm cewek lulusan SMU, AA gym yg langsung dihujat ibu2 stelah kawin lagi.
Dan yg paling parah adalah kehidupan di akhirat. Para intelektual muslim yg berpikit jernih, logis, terbuka & menggunakan akal sehat, sangat-sangat-sangat meragukan kehidupan syurga islam spt yg tercantum dlm kitab suci .Mereka tidak dapat membayangkan bila syurganya nanti seperti Pasar Sex, ada 72 bidadari yg siap melayani nafsu birahi setiap saat, bisa makan minum semaunya, termasuk daging babi, anjing & minuman keras.
Para intelektual itu pasti berpikir jika surga itu tempat berkumpul orang2 yg beriman, taqwa kpd Tuhan & berbuat baik selama hidupnya. Jadi mana mungkin di syurga ada kegiatan yg memalukan seperti itu ?
Dulu para muslim sangat takut bila bertanya ttg hal2 yg ditulis diatas, mereka hanya menerima saja dgn pasrah ajaran nabinya.
Sekarang sdh mulai tumbuh benih2 demokrasi di negara Timur-Tengah, mereka sudah mengenal internet & menggunakan Facebook, Twitter, Google dll. Kesadaran mereka sudah tinggi & meragukan ajaran2 nabinya yg sungguh2 melanggar HAM. Mereka juga sangat membenci para teroris yg membunuh, ngebom orang2 tidak berdosa atas ajaran Islam.
Sekarang adalah era keterbukaan, demokrasi & menjunjung tinggi HAM. Ajaran & kelakukan nabi muhamad benar2 memalukan & tidak dapat dipertanggung jawabkan. Cepat atau lambat mereka akan sadar & Murtad dgn sendirinya.
syurga bidadari- RED MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
@syurga bidadari:
Siapa intelektual yg prihatin dg perbuatan nabi itu?
Siapa intelektual yg prihatin dg perbuatan nabi itu?
bayo_lubis- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
syurga bidadari wrote:Hahahaha...
APA GAK TERBALIK TUH !!!
Islam lah yg akan mendekati kehancuran
Kita bisa liat Revolusi di Timur Tengah, mulai dari Tunisia, Mesir, Libya, sebentar lagi menyusul Maroko, Yaman hingga semua negara Timur Tengah yg kesemua negara itu adalah negara2 diktator yg mayoritas muslim.
Skarang udh jaman globalisasi, keterbukaan, internet hampir menjangkau keseluruh dunia, Orang2 udh berani mengkritik termasuk agamanya sendiri. Hal ini skrang yg terjadi dalam dunia islam, dimana umat muslim sdh dapat berpikir scr logis, jernih & sesuai akal sehat. Mereka sangat meragukan ajaran2 nabi muhamad, termasuk kelakuan nabinya yg trdapat dalam alquran & hadist.
Kebanyakan para intelektual muslim sangat prihatin atas perbuatan nabi muhamad yg membunuh, memenggal & menjadikan budak bagi orang2 yg melawan ajarannya, walaupun ditulis sesuai dgn perintah auloh, tetapi mereka berpikir, bgmn auloh memberikan perintah sekejam itu ?.
Para intelektual muslim jg sangat prihatin atas kelakuan nabi muhamad yg mempunyai sekurang-kurangnya 12 istri, apalagi muhamad sangat berhasrat untuk menikahi Aisyah yg berumur 7 thn & menungganginya umur 9 thn, apalagi muhamad seorang kanibal yg mengawini menantunya sendiri, kaya gak ada wanita lain aja. Ini benar2 kelakuan seorang Phedophil, sex maniac yg memalukan.
Skrg banyak wanita muslim yg protes dg ajaran nabinya ttg poligami, ini terjadi dg walikota bogor yg kawin sm cewek lulusan SMU, AA gym yg langsung dihujat ibu2 stelah kawin lagi.
Dan yg paling parah adalah kehidupan di akhirat. Para intelektual muslim yg berpikit jernih, logis, terbuka & menggunakan akal sehat, sangat-sangat-sangat meragukan kehidupan syurga islam spt yg tercantum dlm kitab suci .Mereka tidak dapat membayangkan bila syurganya nanti seperti Pasar Sex, ada 72 bidadari yg siap melayani nafsu birahi setiap saat, bisa makan minum semaunya, termasuk daging babi, anjing & minuman keras.
Para intelektual itu pasti berpikir jika surga itu tempat berkumpul orang2 yg beriman, taqwa kpd Tuhan & berbuat baik selama hidupnya. Jadi mana mungkin di syurga ada kegiatan yg memalukan seperti itu ?
Dulu para muslim sangat takut bila bertanya ttg hal2 yg ditulis diatas, mereka hanya menerima saja dgn pasrah ajaran nabinya.
Sekarang sdh mulai tumbuh benih2 demokrasi di negara Timur-Tengah, mereka sudah mengenal internet & menggunakan Facebook, Twitter, Google dll. Kesadaran mereka sudah tinggi & meragukan ajaran2 nabinya yg sungguh2 melanggar HAM. Mereka juga sangat membenci para teroris yg membunuh, ngebom orang2 tidak berdosa atas ajaran Islam.
Sekarang adalah era keterbukaan, demokrasi & menjunjung tinggi HAM. Ajaran & kelakukan nabi muhamad benar2 memalukan & tidak dapat dipertanggung jawabkan. Cepat atau lambat mereka akan sadar & Murtad dgn sendirinya.
seperti negara dibawah ini era keterbukaan, demokrasi & menjunjung tinggi HAM
1. Republik Congo - Kristen
2. Zimbabwe - Kristen
3. Burundi - Kristen
4. Liberia - Kristen
5. Eritria - Kristen
hamba tuhan1- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
Sepertinya negara2 di atas adalah kumpulan NEGARA-NEGARA MAKMUR
bayo_lubis- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
lho... denger2 negara mayoritas kristen pinter2 dan makmur sentosa.... pantesan dari negara tsb diatas adalah negara penghasil ilmuwan semua ya????bayo_lubis wrote:Sepertinya negara2 di atas adalah kumpulan NEGARA-NEGARA MAKMUR
hamba tuhan1- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
Kalo itu negara2 makmur, bgmn dgn Negara2 ini ?
1. Amerika serikat 11. Spanyol
2. Inggris 12. Belgia
3. Canada 13. Sewdia
4. Prancis 14. Norwegia
5. Rusia 15. Luxemburg
6. Italia 16. Monako
7. Jerman. 17. Australia
8. Belanda 18. Selandia baru
9. Denmark 19. Finlandia
10. Swiss 20. Austria.
dan masih banyak negara2 yg mayoritas Kristen terbukti makmur karena mejalankan prinsip demokrasi & kebebasan berpendapat.
Negara2 mana sih yg masuk G8 (Negara makmur )
7 negara mayoritas kristen, 1 Jepang. Negara yg mayoritas Islam mana yah?
Negara yg kuat secara ekonomi, militer & politik masuk dlm Dewan Keamanan PBB.
Amerika Serikat, Inggris, Prancis, Rusia & China.. Negara islam mana yah ?
1. Amerika serikat 11. Spanyol
2. Inggris 12. Belgia
3. Canada 13. Sewdia
4. Prancis 14. Norwegia
5. Rusia 15. Luxemburg
6. Italia 16. Monako
7. Jerman. 17. Australia
8. Belanda 18. Selandia baru
9. Denmark 19. Finlandia
10. Swiss 20. Austria.
dan masih banyak negara2 yg mayoritas Kristen terbukti makmur karena mejalankan prinsip demokrasi & kebebasan berpendapat.
Negara2 mana sih yg masuk G8 (Negara makmur )
7 negara mayoritas kristen, 1 Jepang. Negara yg mayoritas Islam mana yah?
Negara yg kuat secara ekonomi, militer & politik masuk dlm Dewan Keamanan PBB.
Amerika Serikat, Inggris, Prancis, Rusia & China.. Negara islam mana yah ?
syurga bidadari- RED MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
syurga bidadari wrote:Kalo itu negara2 makmur, bgmn dgn Negara2 ini ?
1. Amerika serikat 11. Spanyol
2. Inggris 12. Belgia
3. Canada 13. Sewdia
4. Prancis 14. Norwegia
5. Rusia 15. Luxemburg
6. Italia 16. Monako
7. Jerman. 17. Australia
8. Belanda 18. Selandia baru
9. Denmark 19. Finlandia
10. Swiss 20. Austria.
dan masih banyak negara2 yg mayoritas Kristen terbukti makmur karena mejalankan prinsip demokrasi & kebebasan berpendapat.
Negara2 mana sih yg masuk G8 (Negara makmur )
7 negara mayoritas kristen, 1 Jepang. Negara yg mayoritas Islam mana yah?
Negara yg kuat secara ekonomi, militer & politik masuk dlm Dewan Keamanan PBB.
Amerika Serikat, Inggris, Prancis, Rusia & China.. Negara islam mana yah ?
1. Republik Congo - Kristen
2. Zimbabwe - Kristen
3. Burundi - Kristen
4. Liberia - Kristen
5. Eritria - Kristen
6. Timur Leste Negara Kristen Termiskin dan Terbodoh di Asia Tenggara
7. Papua New Guinea Negara Kristen penular Virus HIV/AIDS terparah di dunia
hamba tuhan1- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
cooler wrote:orang-orang barat yang memang bisa berpikir secara lebih kritis dan cerdas, sudah banyak yang sadar, gak mau nyembah tuhan yang punya alat kelamin..
lagipula kalau kristen, gay boleh, lesbi boleh, kawin ama anjing boleh, kawin ama pohon natal, boleh....
yaaa...habis lah lama-lama..
baru denger deh.......
mistik6666- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
mistik6666 wrote:cooler wrote:orang-orang barat yang memang bisa berpikir secara lebih kritis dan cerdas, sudah banyak yang sadar, gak mau nyembah tuhan yang punya alat kelamin..
lagipula kalau kristen, gay boleh, lesbi boleh, kawin ama anjing boleh, kawin ama pohon natal, boleh....
yaaa...habis lah lama-lama..
baru denger deh.......
ini mas bro, contohnya :
"Saya tak lihat alasan mengapa kami tidak bisa terikat dalam perkawinan. Saya pernah dengar tentang orang yang menikahi hewan peliharaan mereka. Jadi, mengapa saya dan pohon natal ini tidak bisa?" (Andy Park)
http://pokahontasimamora.blogspot.com/2011/01/pria-ini-ingin-menikahi-pohon-natal.html
yang pengen menikahi menara eiffel, pernah dengar gak ??
cooler- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
cooler wrote:mistik6666 wrote:cooler wrote:orang-orang barat yang memang bisa berpikir secara lebih kritis dan cerdas, sudah banyak yang sadar, gak mau nyembah tuhan yang punya alat kelamin..
lagipula kalau kristen, gay boleh, lesbi boleh, kawin ama anjing boleh, kawin ama pohon natal, boleh....
yaaa...habis lah lama-lama..
baru denger deh.......
wakakakak....wong edaaannn..ngawinin pohon natal...yang ngawini manusia di hujat2 malah yang ngawini binatang dibiarain....weleh2
ini mas bro, contohnya :
"Saya tak lihat alasan mengapa kami tidak bisa terikat dalam perkawinan. Saya pernah dengar tentang orang yang menikahi hewan peliharaan mereka. Jadi, mengapa saya dan pohon natal ini tidak bisa?" (Andy Park)
http://pokahontasimamora.blogspot.com/2011/01/pria-ini-ingin-menikahi-pohon-natal.html
yang pengen menikahi menara eiffel, pernah dengar gak ??
sabda alam- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
alhamdulillah makin banyak orang yang meninggalkan TIANG JEMURAN
LEBIH CEPAT LEBIH BAIK... MENYONGSONG KEPUNAHAN KRISTEN DIDUNIA
LEBIH CEPAT LEBIH BAIK... MENYONGSONG KEPUNAHAN KRISTEN DIDUNIA
menjawab.fitnah- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
Tiang jemuran buat jemur baju apa orang bromenjawab.fitnah wrote:alhamdulillah makin banyak orang yang meninggalkan TIANG JEMURAN
LEBIH CEPAT LEBIH BAIK... MENYONGSONG KEPUNAHAN KRISTEN DIDUNIA
sabda alam- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
sabda alam wrote:Tiang jemuran buat jemur baju apa orang bromenjawab.fitnah wrote:alhamdulillah makin banyak orang yang meninggalkan TIANG JEMURAN
LEBIH CEPAT LEBIH BAIK... MENYONGSONG KEPUNAHAN KRISTEN DIDUNIA
DUA DUANYA BRO BUAT JEMURAN PAKAIAN SEKALIGUS BUAT JEMUR ORANG
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
jelasnggak wrote:cooler wrote:pengakuan jujur dari Kardinal Wina :
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
MEMANG BETUL TOH APA YG DIKATAKAN KARDINAL TSB.
DI KRISTEN TIDAK BOLEH KAWIN CERAI SEENAKNYA....
BERBEDA DENGAN DI ISLAM,..
KALAU DI ISLAM,.. KAU BOLEH KAWIN SAMPAI 4 KALI, ASAL MAMPU ADIL.
KALAU ISTRI TUA SUDAH MEMBOSANKAN, MAKA BOLEH DI CERAI.
KALAU DICERAI, ISTRI SEKARANG TINGGAL 3 DOONGGG...
KALAU SUDAH 3 TENTU BOLEH TAMBAH LAGI SATU.. (MASIH ADA SATU SPOT YG KOSONG)
...
NAH...
DI KRISTEN NGGA ADA YG KAYAK GINI....
KALAU SUDAH KAWIN-KAWIN-AN SEPERTI BEGITU,.... NANTI AKAN MASUK SURGA, KARENA PADA DASARNYA MEREKA CUMAN MELAKSANAKAN SUNAH NABINYA (KAWINILAH DUA, TIGA, EMPAT)....
NAH DI SURGA LEBIH ENAK LAGI NANTI....
MEREKA BISA ESEK-ESEK DARI PAGI SAMPAI MALAM TRUUUUSSSSSSSS GOYANG....
KARENA DISURGA MEREKA ADA 72 BIDADARI YANG MENANTI GILIRAN UNTUK DI ESEK.
NAH INI YG GAK ADA DI KRISTEN.
GILA BENER,.. KAYAK ROKOK JI SAM SUE SAJA (DUA TIGA EMPAT)
HA HA HA
emang kata siapa di kristen gk boleh poligami?
Yesus kakek buyutnya.....emang gk poligami??
Tuhan anda itu yg bawa Ee kemana2...itu keturunan Poligami!
kristen larang poligami??hahaha...MIMPI BASAH YAH ANDA??
mana ayatnya..kasih sini!
cerai?kata siapa gk bolehhhhhhhh...!!!mimpi Basah lagi yah???
boleh kok..syaratnya malah asoooooy....cari cewek..zina aja..cerai deh..
musicman- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
jelasnggak otak-nya sudah nggakjelas, jadi memahami agama-nya saja tidak mampu....musicman wrote:jelasnggak wrote:cooler wrote:pengakuan jujur dari Kardinal Wina :
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
MEMANG BETUL TOH APA YG DIKATAKAN KARDINAL TSB.
DI KRISTEN TIDAK BOLEH KAWIN CERAI SEENAKNYA....
BERBEDA DENGAN DI ISLAM,..
KALAU DI ISLAM,.. KAU BOLEH KAWIN SAMPAI 4 KALI, ASAL MAMPU ADIL.
KALAU ISTRI TUA SUDAH MEMBOSANKAN, MAKA BOLEH DI CERAI.
KALAU DICERAI, ISTRI SEKARANG TINGGAL 3 DOONGGG...
KALAU SUDAH 3 TENTU BOLEH TAMBAH LAGI SATU.. (MASIH ADA SATU SPOT YG KOSONG)
...
NAH...
DI KRISTEN NGGA ADA YG KAYAK GINI....
KALAU SUDAH KAWIN-KAWIN-AN SEPERTI BEGITU,.... NANTI AKAN MASUK SURGA, KARENA PADA DASARNYA MEREKA CUMAN MELAKSANAKAN SUNAH NABINYA (KAWINILAH DUA, TIGA, EMPAT)....
NAH DI SURGA LEBIH ENAK LAGI NANTI....
MEREKA BISA ESEK-ESEK DARI PAGI SAMPAI MALAM TRUUUUSSSSSSSS GOYANG....
KARENA DISURGA MEREKA ADA 72 BIDADARI YANG MENANTI GILIRAN UNTUK DI ESEK.
NAH INI YG GAK ADA DI KRISTEN.
GILA BENER,.. KAYAK ROKOK JI SAM SUE SAJA (DUA TIGA EMPAT)
HA HA HA
emang kata siapa di kristen gk boleh poligami?
Yesus kakek buyutnya.....emang gk poligami??
Tuhan anda itu yg bawa Ee kemana2...itu keturunan Poligami!
kristen larang poligami??hahaha...MIMPI BASAH YAH ANDA??
mana ayatnya..kasih sini!
cerai?kata siapa gk bolehhhhhhhh...!!!mimpi Basah lagi yah???
boleh kok..syaratnya malah asoooooy....cari cewek..zina aja..cerai deh..
Eh, malah terbuai ajaran Paulus sesat dr Tarsoes....
Kaum Salibasi....
Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
wa..sich jelasnggak ini perlu sekolah seminggu bukan sekolah minggu lagiBOTELHEM wrote:jelasnggak otak-nya sudah nggakjelas, jadi memahami agama-nya saja tidak mampu....musicman wrote:jelasnggak wrote:cooler wrote:pengakuan jujur dari Kardinal Wina :
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
MEMANG BETUL TOH APA YG DIKATAKAN KARDINAL TSB.
DI KRISTEN TIDAK BOLEH KAWIN CERAI SEENAKNYA....
BERBEDA DENGAN DI ISLAM,..
KALAU DI ISLAM,.. KAU BOLEH KAWIN SAMPAI 4 KALI, ASAL MAMPU ADIL.
KALAU ISTRI TUA SUDAH MEMBOSANKAN, MAKA BOLEH DI CERAI.
KALAU DICERAI, ISTRI SEKARANG TINGGAL 3 DOONGGG...
KALAU SUDAH 3 TENTU BOLEH TAMBAH LAGI SATU.. (MASIH ADA SATU SPOT YG KOSONG)
...
NAH...
DI KRISTEN NGGA ADA YG KAYAK GINI....
KALAU SUDAH KAWIN-KAWIN-AN SEPERTI BEGITU,.... NANTI AKAN MASUK SURGA, KARENA PADA DASARNYA MEREKA CUMAN MELAKSANAKAN SUNAH NABINYA (KAWINILAH DUA, TIGA, EMPAT)....
NAH DI SURGA LEBIH ENAK LAGI NANTI....
MEREKA BISA ESEK-ESEK DARI PAGI SAMPAI MALAM TRUUUUSSSSSSSS GOYANG....
KARENA DISURGA MEREKA ADA 72 BIDADARI YANG MENANTI GILIRAN UNTUK DI ESEK.
NAH INI YG GAK ADA DI KRISTEN.
GILA BENER,.. KAYAK ROKOK JI SAM SUE SAJA (DUA TIGA EMPAT)
HA HA HA
emang kata siapa di kristen gk boleh poligami?
Yesus kakek buyutnya.....emang gk poligami??
Tuhan anda itu yg bawa Ee kemana2...itu keturunan Poligami!
kristen larang poligami??hahaha...MIMPI BASAH YAH ANDA??
mana ayatnya..kasih sini!
cerai?kata siapa gk bolehhhhhhhh...!!!mimpi Basah lagi yah???
boleh kok..syaratnya malah asoooooy....cari cewek..zina aja..cerai deh..
Eh, malah terbuai ajaran Paulus sesat dr Tarsoes....
Kaum Salibasi....
sabda alam- BLUE MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
@botelhem
betul bung...
dalam Islam dibatasi 4 istri..
dlm kristen...10...100....1000...10.000 istri juga boleh!!!!gk ada larangan Poligami..dan batasan jumlah istri!!!
Cerai katanya gk boleh dalam kristen???
hahahaha..
suruh aja si jelas ngga bawa ayat2 yg dia klaim diatas dilarang...sampe BEGO jg ngga bakal ketemu!!!!!
susah..otak sakit!!!gk punya cermin...
betul bung...
dalam Islam dibatasi 4 istri..
dlm kristen...10...100....1000...10.000 istri juga boleh!!!!gk ada larangan Poligami..dan batasan jumlah istri!!!
Cerai katanya gk boleh dalam kristen???
hahahaha..
suruh aja si jelas ngga bawa ayat2 yg dia klaim diatas dilarang...sampe BEGO jg ngga bakal ketemu!!!!!
susah..otak sakit!!!gk punya cermin...
musicman- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
musicman wrote:@botelhem
betul bung...
dalam Islam dibatasi 4 istri..
dlm kristen...10...100....1000...10.000 istri juga boleh!!!!gk ada larangan Poligami..dan batasan jumlah istri!!!
Cerai katanya gk boleh dalam kristen???
hahahaha..
suruh aja si jelas ngga bawa ayat2 yg dia klaim diatas dilarang...sampe BEGO jg ngga bakal ketemu!!!!!
susah..otak sakit!!!gk punya cermin...
ha ha
1000 istri haha..
pasti wawasan anda sangat luas mengenai kristen ha ha..
makanya saya selalu mengikuti tafsir anda atas agama kristen ha ha.....
salam
Piss- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
cooler wrote:pengakuan jujur dari Kardinal Wina :
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
ha ha...
bukti mendekati akhir zaman...
semakin banyak yang disesatkan dan... dikadalin ha ha
salam
Piss- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
Hahahaha
hambatuhan1, hambanya batu hitam hajar aswad pengikut muhamad yg tukang kawin, phedophil, genjot Aisyah umur 9taon, tukang jagal manusia. Kayanya sih lu gak pernah sekolah, bisa2nya ngebandingin negara2 islam & negara2 kristen dalam kemakmuran, demoktasi & iptek..hahaha...
Anak SD juga tau negara2 mana yg makmur, super power & berdemokrasi ??
Lu baca kompas hari sabtu, mau tau gak negara islam yg paling kaya berdasarkan GDP/ Produk Domestik Bruto ? mau tau ? jawabannya negara tercinta Indonesia !! punya GDP sekitar 600 milyar $ (masuk G20). Lu bisa bayangin gak negara islam paling kaya Indonesia itu msh banyak gembel, gelandangan, pengemis & teroris ?
Hadapi dong kenyataan yg ada, jgn membela membabi buta. Kenyataan dlm kitab suci agamalu yg tertulis ttg kelakuan si muhamad aja lu bantah mati2an, apalagi realita para islamer dalam kehidupan nyata sekarang ini, apa yg mau dibanggain ?
Makanya jgn berpikir ttg syurga maksiatlu setiap hari, di syurga kok ada kegiatan maksiat, bener2 memalukan !
hambatuhan1, hambanya batu hitam hajar aswad pengikut muhamad yg tukang kawin, phedophil, genjot Aisyah umur 9taon, tukang jagal manusia. Kayanya sih lu gak pernah sekolah, bisa2nya ngebandingin negara2 islam & negara2 kristen dalam kemakmuran, demoktasi & iptek..hahaha...
Anak SD juga tau negara2 mana yg makmur, super power & berdemokrasi ??
Lu baca kompas hari sabtu, mau tau gak negara islam yg paling kaya berdasarkan GDP/ Produk Domestik Bruto ? mau tau ? jawabannya negara tercinta Indonesia !! punya GDP sekitar 600 milyar $ (masuk G20). Lu bisa bayangin gak negara islam paling kaya Indonesia itu msh banyak gembel, gelandangan, pengemis & teroris ?
Hadapi dong kenyataan yg ada, jgn membela membabi buta. Kenyataan dlm kitab suci agamalu yg tertulis ttg kelakuan si muhamad aja lu bantah mati2an, apalagi realita para islamer dalam kehidupan nyata sekarang ini, apa yg mau dibanggain ?
Makanya jgn berpikir ttg syurga maksiatlu setiap hari, di syurga kok ada kegiatan maksiat, bener2 memalukan !
syurga bidadari- RED MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
syurga bidadari wrote:Hahahaha
hambatuhan1, hambanya batu hitam hajar aswad pengikut muhamad yg tukang kawin, phedophil, genjot Aisyah umur 9taon, tukang jagal manusia. Kayanya sih lu gak pernah sekolah, bisa2nya ngebandingin negara2 islam & negara2 kristen dalam kemakmuran, demoktasi & iptek..hahaha...
Anak SD juga tau negara2 mana yg makmur, super power & berdemokrasi ??
Lu baca kompas hari sabtu, mau tau gak negara islam yg paling kaya berdasarkan GDP/ Produk Domestik Bruto ? mau tau ? jawabannya negara tercinta Indonesia !! punya GDP sekitar 600 milyar $ (masuk G20). Lu bisa bayangin gak negara islam paling kaya Indonesia itu msh banyak gembel, gelandangan, pengemis & teroris ?
Hadapi dong kenyataan yg ada, jgn membela membabi buta. Kenyataan dlm kitab suci agamalu yg tertulis ttg kelakuan si muhamad aja lu bantah mati2an, apalagi realita para islamer dalam kehidupan nyata sekarang ini, apa yg mau dibanggain ?
Makanya jgn berpikir ttg syurga maksiatlu setiap hari, di syurga kok ada kegiatan maksiat, bener2 memalukan !
nah... anda gak ngerti gmn surgakan??? ngerti seh... beybel gak ngejelasin gmn surga..... kasian benar kaum tersesat.... surganya dipenuhi pelacur, gay, lesbian, pemabok dan tukang palak....
hamba tuhan1- SILVER MEMBERS
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Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
Piss wrote:cooler wrote:pengakuan jujur dari Kardinal Wina :
Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya..
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2009/apr/09041410
The Cardinal Archbishop of Vienna has warned that Christianity in Europe is dying out. Christoph Cardinal Schönborn said at St. Stephen’s Cathedral on Easter Sunday, "The time of Christianity in Europe is coming to an end. A Christianity, which achieved such great things like this cathedral or the wonderful music we will hear today."
Cardinal Schönborn’s Easter homily follows comments he made earlier in which he criticised Austrian Church leaders for their failure to accept and promote the watershed 1968 papal encyclical Humanae Vitae that reiterated the Church’s teaching against artificial birth control.
In March last year, the cardinal said that many bishops are "frightened of the press and of being misunderstood by the faithful." The result is that contraception has become widely accepted and Europe is "about to die out."
In this Sunday’s homily, the cardinal addressed the obsession of the secular media with the Church’s teachings on sexuality, saying that it has been the subject of a "massive preconception" that the Church is opposed to sexual happiness and freedom.
"The Church can help people acquire the right attitude towards sex, which is not an isolated thing of all-consuming importance. The quality of the entire relationship is what is important in a male-female partnership," he said.
The decline of the Catholic Church in Austria mirrors that of the rest of Europe since the advent of the 1960s "sexual revolution." While official Vatican statistics say that 72.7 percent of Austrians are Catholic, a 2005 European Social Survey found that just 63.9 percent of Austrians actually describe themselves as such and almost 30 percent say they have no religious affiliation at all. Weekly Mass attendance among Catholics in the country hovers around 10 percent and, between 1985 and 2002, the number of priests in Austria dropped by almost one-quarter.
ha ha...
bukti mendekati akhir zaman...
semakin banyak yang disesatkan dan... dikadalin ha ha
salam
ehm... ada prediksi akhir zaman versi si piss neh!!!! kemaren yg di USA meleset....
hamba tuhan1- SILVER MEMBERS
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Location : aceh
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Points : 5981
Registration date : 2011-07-01
Re: Kristen Eropa nyaris tamat riwayatnya
musicman wrote:@botelhem
betul bung...
dalam Islam dibatasi 4 istri..
dlm kristen...10...100....1000...10.000 istri juga boleh!!!!gk ada larangan Poligami..dan batasan jumlah istri!!!
Cerai katanya gk boleh dalam kristen???
hahahaha..
suruh aja si jelas ngga bawa ayat2 yg dia klaim diatas dilarang...sampe BEGO jg ngga bakal ketemu!!!!!
susah..otak sakit!!!gk punya cermin...
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